When I called Al Carnesciali recently, the first thing I asked him was, “Where are you?”
I knew he was in California, but not where exactly. And Al said, “I’m in San Juan Capistrano, a couple of miles from the ocean. It’s a sunny day, the wind is starting to pick up. I can see the green hills to the east of me, and even though I can’t see the ocean, I can smell it.” San Juan Capistrano, he explained, lies “about 60 miles or so south of Los Angeles. It’s right between LA and San Diego.”
Turns out there was a lot I didn’t know about Mr. Carnesciali that went way beyond where he calls home. I didn’t know, for example, that he had been a Trustee of The Christian Science Publishing Society (publisher of the Journal). Or that he had also been a member of the Christian Science Board of Directors. Or that prior to serving in those capacities, he had pursued successful careers in government and aerospace.
All of which he explained—and more, much more—when I asked him to talk about the events that led him to become a Christian Science practitioner and teacher.
Al Carnesciali: I guess I would start out to say that I had no religious training when I grew up. I just never went to church, never discussed religion. When I went into the Navy, as an electronics technician, my mother gave me a copy of Science and Health, but I didn’t greet it with very much appreciation. In fact, I told her, “Mother, this is just another one of your crazy ideas.” And I’ve eaten those words many times since, of course. But I had a healing after I decided I’d read it. And I really was taken by the logic of it, even though I didn’t totally recognize the spirituality of it. So later, when I graduated from college and then earned a master’s degree in public administration, I began my career and soon became a city manager, actually starting a city in Southern California—Imperial Beach, below San Diego, on the border with Mexico. That experience helped me appreciate organizations, especially political organizations. And at the same time, I had a continuing desire to progress in Christian Science. Now, I should mention that my desire had been to go into medical practice, but when my mother gave me Science and Health, it completely changed everything.
Why do you think your mom gave you that book?
Interestingly, she had been ill for a few years with headaches, and she went into a Christian Science Reading Room in the San Fernando Valley. They gave her the book, so she wanted me to have it.
Science and Health had helped her, and so she wanted, ideally, for it to help you somehow?
Yes, that’s right. But she and I, in a family of five, were the only ones who became Christian Scientists. My dad disdained it at the beginning, but then, in later years, he had a healing in Science and totally appreciated it, even though he didn’t become a Christian Scientist. I relied on Science for all my health needs and for the progression of work in my field. I went into aerospace after I left the city manager job and became manager of contracts, and then I became associate manager of administration for another company. After that I went to work for The Mother Church.
When was that, and what did you do?
I first went to work for The Mother Church right around when the Church Center was being constructed, in the late 1960s, and I was manager of administrative and technical services.
So you were here during the construction of the current campus?
I was directly involved in getting the plans worked on. Because of my background in electronics and in aerospace, I was technically knowledgeable. And the Christian Science Board of Directors hired me because they felt I wasn’t a “yes man,” and so it kind of worked out well. I worked there seven years and then came back to California and immediately went into the public healing practice because I had so much desire to do it. It wasn’t the easiest thing, because we still had two children we had to support. But God did carry us through all that. I advertised my practice in the Journal almost immediately when I got back to California—we were living in Costa Mesa, near Newport Beach, at the time. And then four years later, in 1979, I went through Normal class to become a teacher of Christian Science. Eventually, I became Christian Science Committee on Publication for Southern California, serving for eight years in that capacity, and then several years as a Trustee of the Publishing Society. In 1990, I moved back to Boston and went to work again for The Mother Church, this time as a Board member for two years, which included serving simultaneously as Manager of the Publishing Society.
So I went from no religion whatsoever to total immersion in Christian Science, and I deeply felt the desire to practice it. The journey changed my whole life, of course. It was a journey that started with reading a book, Science and Health, and that went on to include full-time Christian Science practice and church service.
That first healing you had when you read Science and Health—tell me about it.
Well, it was a healing of a congenital hernia. I was playing football for Treasure Island Navy and developed pain and went to the Naval surgeon. He said I should be operated on. So I said, “Well, I’d like to wait until I finish electronics school in four months.” About that time I started really reading Science and Health, not so much for healing, but for a better understanding. And then the hernia disappeared. So I was very much impressed by that, and I thought, “This really does work.”
Well, I can imagine that such a healing would, indeed, be life-altering.
Yes, I recall reading in Science and Health that “Truth has a healing effect, even when not fully understood,” Science and Health, p. 152. and I didn’t understand that from beans, really. I didn’t know very much about Christian Science, but it was enough at the time to cause healing.
Could you share an example of a recent healing?
Well, I could tell about a healing of a tooth, a molar. My tooth seemed to be loose and very painful. I prayed, always starting with God, to realize that He was in charge and that I was a spiritual idea. The healing came very quickly, and I can bite on the tooth, and it’s perfectly normal now. There’s not a single difficulty with it, and that healing really was quite well received on my part!
I’ll bet! Did a dentist look at your tooth and offer any kind of diagnosis?
Well, I had been to a dentist about nine months or so earlier, and he indicated there was something there, but didn’t work on it. But, as I said, it became extremely painful and swollen, so I really had to work on it myself from a metaphysical standpoint.
I’ve had good success with teeth, going back to what happened a long time ago, which was quite outstanding and gave me great confidence in praying about teeth. It was when I was working in aerospace. I was quite busy and developed two bad wisdom teeth. I went to the dentist, and the dentist said, “Oh, you need an oral surgeon to remove those because of their condition.” So I prayed about it quite a bit and then went to the oral surgeon. The nurse asked me if I would like a local anesthetic or to be put asleep? I said, “I’d like neither if that’s all right.” Her hands started shaking, because I think she thought she had some sort of kook on her hands. So the surgeon came, and he said, “I understand you wouldn’t like either benefit,” and I said, “Well, it’s really up to you. I believe I can handle the situation. I’m a Christian Scientist, but I don’t want to disturb your work.” And he said, “Well, heck, the nerve ends are on your side, not on mine, so we can do it, if you want to.” It turned out very well. He pulled the first one—he said it would be like rowing a boat—and there was no bleeding. But the second one he had to drill into and hook out. It really showed me that you could have that type of work done and not suffer any pain or difficulty. So it really gave me great confidence in what could be accomplished through a growing metaphysical understanding.
I prayed for her in the same way that I prayed for myself, realizing her spirituality and acknowledging God’s power and presence through the Christ, the influence of divine Love in human consciousness.
-Al Carnesciali
It was a completely pain-free procedure for you?
Yes, it was, and the dentist was amazed. He told me that he’d heard about things like that in medical school, but he’d never seen anything like that. In fact, he said, “I want more Christian Science patients.”
That helps answer the question of why you didn’t go to the dentist during your recent difficulty—years ago you’d had this remarkable proof of dominion over pain in matter, and that success fortified your feeling that you could do it again. Am I right?
Yes, that’s exactly it. Experiences like that first one do give you more confidence as you go along. You realize that healing doesn’t have to be something that’s long in happening, but it can happen successfully and quite quickly.
Could you explain in more detail how you prayed.
My prayer was much more efficient in this recent challenge than it was back then.
First of all, I might remark that since coming into Christian Science many years back, I’ve relied totally on spiritual healing for all my health-care needs. So in this particular case, I started where I had learned always to start, and that is to begin with God and recognize His all-power and infinite goodness and greatness—and recognize that we are His ideas. We’re spiritual. I recognized that my spirituality was my substance, and it could not be assailed or decayed or hurt in any way. I began to realize that this trouble with my tooth presented a misconception of my true selfhood, and that I couldn’t be made to suffer pain, because, as a spiritual idea, I was exempt from and immune to that pain—and from any of the troubles that mortal mind was proclaiming or predicting. So, as I said, the healing came quite rapidly. It didn’t amaze me, but it sure pleased me.
You know, speaking of dealing with pain, there was also a fairly recent healing of an individual I was praying for who had badly hurt her ankle. It had swollen to the size of a grapefruit—as she described it. And she couldn’t put any weight on it. She was in great pain and asked me to pray. And I prayed for her in the same way that I prayed for myself, realizing her spirituality and acknowledging God’s power and presence through the Christ, the influence of divine Love in human consciousness. The suffering that she experienced the night before was pretty much gone in the morning. She was much better. But her family wanted her to go be checked out by a doctor. When she went, the doctor said things were perfectly all right, that the healing had proceeded and there would be no more trouble. And it was just that quick.
That’s beautiful, Al. And, of course, anybody who hears or reads your account of mastering pain with respect to your teeth or this woman’s ankle can apply the same spiritual principle to any aspect of their own life where they’re dealing with pain.
That’s true. This spiritual principle—a principle in accord with divine Principle, God—is universal and is readily available to everyone.
There was another recent healing of a woman who came to me because of great back pain—and I might mention that she, too, is a Christian Science practitioner. Of course, you can imagine two practitioners addressing the trouble would really have quite an effect! She was praying for herself, of course, and I was supporting her, affirming that her faithful metaphysical stand must surely yield tangible results. And in two or three days, she was completely free of any discomfort.
The woman you helped with the ankle, was she a Christian Scientist and also praying for herself?
She first became acquainted with Science years ago, but didn’t stay with it. Then fairly recently she took class instruction, because she decided that Christian Science was what she wanted to rely on. And so, yes, she did pray for herself, and I supported her in prayer. And she found the healing came very quickly. In fact, the family was just amazed. They couldn’t believe it. They’re not fully accepting of Science, but they couldn’t deny that the healing happened.
Your success in rejecting pain is very encouraging, because so many people are dealing with pain of all kinds, with physical pain, but also emotional pain, financial pain, work-related or joblessness pain. People might be in misery in their love life or facing something as small as a stubbed toe or as monumental as getting a pink slip at the office.
Yes, it’s all-pervasive in terms of people suffering from pain. That, of course, is a lie about God’s creation, about God’s ability to govern man harmoniously.
Go a little further, Al. Talk some more about the kind of metaphysical viewpoint that can help people alleviate pain and enjoy their Spirit-sourced well-being.
Yes, well, the need of course is to, as Mrs. Eddy says, “Look away from the body into Truth and Love . . . .” Ibid., p. 261. That requires some effort, but it can be done. And I think one can find an immediate blessing by starting with God as All-in-all, supreme, infinite, almighty, the great I am—just expanding your view of God. Because as you expand your view of God, divine Truth, you begin to see that error has no reality, no basis whatsoever. You can realize that as a spiritual idea, you can’t be controlled by false beliefs. All pain really is, bottom line, is a false belief. Pain has no basis whatsoever in fact.
I like to think of the word acknowledge. Mrs. Eddy uses it six times in the tenets of Christian Science. The word means to “accept as fact.” And when you accept as fact that God is Father-Mother, God—Father-Mother, Love—you’ve realized that you’re really held precious by God, and you can rely on Him absolutely. Mrs. Eddy tells us, of course, “Always begin your treatment by allaying the fear of patients.” Ibid., p 411. And you want to handle that sense of fear. It’s very important to do that, very important to realize that you can’t be made to fear, or that the patient can’t be made to fear. And then you proceed by realizing the nothingness of the lie, because God is so powerful and does love each one in His own creation so wonderfully. And the healing just has to come. It’s inevitable.
And when it comes to successfully caring for patients, Mary Baker Eddy follows that line in Science and Health that you quoted with this: “Silently reassure them as to their exemption from disease and danger.” Which also applies to silently reassuring oneself of that exemption—a good way to pray every day, I’ve found.
That’s right—me, too. You know, I hope you won’t think it disrespectful, but the “silently reassure” part of that reference I call the “Keep your trap shut!” advice. And by that I mean myself, of course, not the patient. “Silently reassure them as to their exemption from disease and danger.” And how do you do that? You have to be very quiet.
Mary Baker Eddy’s counsel on this matter is so interesting, isn’t it, because we know that elsewhere she advocated speaking aloud to a patient. See ibid., pp. 420–421. But here she makes a point of saying do this assurance silently. Why do you think that is?
I think because, as I’ve found in the practice, sometimes when you focus on the trouble an individual faces, the trouble becomes more intense. And so when you tell a patient, “Don’t be afraid of this,” they suddenly think, “Well, gee, I’ve got something to fear now.” So I think Mary Baker Eddy must have seen right through that and learned from experience the calming influence of silent reassurance.
God, the divine Mind, has a Science, and it’s the most wonderful Science that we could ever imagine, and that it does bring healing and harmony.
-Al Carnesciali
I wonder if you could describe a moment of recent inspiration—perhaps a passage from the Bible or Science and Health—and how it has helped you.
What leaps to mind are related passages in the Bible and Science and Health that have opened my eyes wider to some things. I’m thinking of Isaiah, from about chapters 42 to about 45, where it says in various parts, “I am the Lord [thy God], and there is none else.” Isaiah 45:5. Or, “Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.” Isa. 44:8. I suddenly realized recently that God is declaring Himself. He’s causing Himself to be understood. And that’s so helpful because oftentimes we think, “Well, I can’t hear God.” But Science reveals God to us. And we can realize that He is declaring Himself, causing Himself to be understood, causing Himself to be felt.
And then there’s a page in Science and Health where Mrs. Eddy wrote, “Spirit, bearing opposite testimony . . .”—pointing out that there is opposite testimony to the false evidence of the material senses. She points out that Spirit, God, says, “I am Spirit. Man, whose senses are spiritual, is my likeness. He reflects the infinite understanding, for I am Infinity.” Science and Health, pp. 252- 253. And so we see there that God is declaring Himself.
That was so tremendously helpful to me to realize that He’s always revealing Himself through Science. Science is bringing Him to us.
Mrs. Eddy asks on another page, “Has God no Science to declare Mind, while matter is governed by unerring intelligence?” Ibid., p. 546. And I got to thinking about that, and I suddenly realized, “My goodness, that’s one of the most important questions in Science and Health. Surely, God must have a Science. And God’s Science is the only Science, and it’s governed by unerring intelligence and is absolutely reliable.”
Now, in the second part of Mrs. Eddy’s question, she calls attention to the absurd notion that matter could possibly be “governed by unerring intelligence.” Matter may be the basis of physical, so-called science, but as Mrs. Eddy makes clear throughout Science and Health, Spirit alone exists. Spirit, God, alone has actual power and substance. Matter just doesn’t exist. And all intelligence belongs to Mind.
So that thought that God, the divine Mind, has a Science, and it’s the most wonderful Science that we could ever imagine, and that it does bring healing and harmony—that’s probably the biggest moment of inspiration I’ve had recently.
Well, I can see why. That’s a profound question that Science and Health raises, and a question that I can’t recall, even though I’ve studied the book throughout my life. And the question is all the more telling in light of a much-touted line by the astrophysicist Stephen Hawking, who said that “science makes God unnecessary.”
Yes, yes. In fact, I started to write an article about that. Obviously, what Hawking has in mind when he uses the word “God” is a very different notion than what you and I have in mind when we talk about God.
Let’s address that for a moment, because when you refer to God as “He” or “Himself,” you don’t mean that God is male or that God is Jesus. You referred to God earlier as Father-Mother and in terms of various synonyms. Could you explain a little more what you mean by God?
Well, God is Spirit. And so God isn’t material. God isn’t in matter. God doesn’t create matter. The substance of God’s creation—Spirit’s creation—is spiritual. Mrs. Eddy tells us, “We must look deep into realism instead of accepting only the outward sense of things.” Ibid., p. 129. What we see of the material universe is a counterfeit of the true universe, which exists entirely in Spirit, in Mind. The material universe is simply “the outward sense of things.” But when we look deeply, we realize that Mind, not matter, is the basis of reality. And we realize that God, divine Love, constantly nurtures and renews all of creation, but Love’s creation is spiritual, not material.
I can’t help thinking back to what you said about God’s Science. And when we consider God in terms of another synonym, Life, then surely when we look deeply into Life we see that it must be scientific, must surely operate according to firm laws.
Yes, exactly, and what goes hand in hand with that, as Mrs. Eddy determined, is that there can’t be any actual material science, because any research built on matter can’t ultimately be true, because matter is ultimately without foundation or reality. And that’s where Stephen Hawking—if I can say it, I mean he’s such a brilliant person—where he sort of misses the boat. He’s looking for God in matter, and there is no God in matter. God is infinite Spirit, Soul, Life, our divine Principle, and as we realize that, it really broadens our outlook on our own identity. As God’s creation, God’s expression, we are spiritual and perfect and complete and whole. We reflect infinite intelligence and wisdom, and we therefore have inherent dominion over every claim of matter and mortality.
You just reminded me of another great line by Mary Baker Eddy: “And how is man, seen through the lens of Spirit, enlarged, and how counterpoised his origin from dust, and how he presses to his original, never severed from Spirit!” The First Church of Christ, Scientist, and Miscellany, p. 129. That’s what you’re talking about, isn’t it?
Yes. It’s so beautiful, that statement. And that view of ourselves that Mrs. Eddy revealed, a view that goes far beyond a material conception of our origin and nature, can only be understood by looking through the lens of God’s Science, and not through the counterfeit lens of material
science.
And you know, when we get a correct view of reality, when we see that God is Spirit, that God is Truth, we can actually make the following counter-statement to Professor Hawking’s: God’s Science makes matter unnecessary.
Oh, yes. Very good. God’s Science makes matter unnecessary. And therefore makes pain unnecessary—even more, reduces matter and pain to a mere illusion. And, you know, it seems to me that the way things are going, it will become too expensive to live in matter, and we’ll have to turn to Spirit just to survive!
Aha! And here’s the good news: The spiritual qualities that can meet our human needs and transform our lives flow continuously from our divine Spirit, and these qualities are as free as the air we breathe.
Yes, yes, how right you are. Good in every form that anyone needs is freely given. We don’t have to earn it. We don’t have to work hard to receive it. We just have to acknowledge it—and there I use that word again; that word acknowledge is so important. We just have to steadfastly acknowledge that good is present here and now and reigns supreme in everyone’s life.
And expect the power of that spiritually scientific reality to shape and adjust our human lives in tangible ways. Right?
Right. Acknowledge God, expect good, which Mary Baker Eddy pointed out has long been another term for God. Science and Health, p. 286.
Any final thoughts, Al?
Well, you know, Jeffrey, as a practitioner and teacher of Christian Science, I get to engage in the most wonderful effort that could ever be imagined: spiritual healing. And one thing I would like to underscore about spiritual healing—and I always keep this in mind—is that God does the healing, not me or you or other people. Spiritual healing results from trusting in the power of Truth to bring harmony to any situation.
And so I also keep in mind that spiritual healing is inevitable, because Truth has all power and can’t be stopped.
Spiritual healing is backed by Truth—by God’s Science, by the Science of divine Principle, Mind, Spirit, Love. I think acknowledging this contributes to effective healing.
