In this Sentinel Watch podcast, adapted for print, David Brown talks with John Biggs, a Christian Science practitioner from St. Louis, Missouri. To hear the entire podcast, visit cssentinel.com/dont-be-deceived.
David Brown: Many folks come across Christian Science for the first time after hearing about someone who’s had a healing. Imagine how people felt during Jesus’ time when long-standing physical conditions were instantly healed through Jesus’ crystal-clear understanding of everyone’s perfect, God-given nature—a nature that can’t be taken away.
One of the reasons I love Christian Science is that it isn’t just something wonderful from another time. It can be demonstrated in our own lives here and now. I’ve seen it repeatedly in my own life, and thousands of others around the world have demonstrated that same powerful Truth for themselves.
So what’s going on when we find ourselves in trouble, suffering with some condition or situation that doesn’t line up with what Jesus taught the world about our right to be free? Well, let’s begin with the basics. There are no tricks involved, no miracles either. Our guest today, John Biggs, has a lot of insight into this. As a Christian Science practitioner, he’s engaged in the public practice of healing. And he applies the same laws Jesus did to modern everyday situations. John, nice to talk with you again.
John Biggs: It’s great to be with you, David.
So, Christian Science is definitely not magic. Could you explain?
Absolutely, yes. Christian Science is not magic. It is the truth as taught by Jesus and illustrated in the Bible; the truth that Mary Baker Eddy, the Discoverer and Founder of Christian Science, illuminated and illustrated for us all in her works, in her writings. And I have an example I can give of a healing I experienced that I think will help illustrate this.
Several months ago, I felt so sick. I couldn’t move and I had a Bible Lesson study that I needed to participate in. I wasn’t going to be able to go and I was really concerned. I thought, “Do I need to just push through? What do I do?” I was practically panicking because I was so impressed with what seemed to be happening.
All of a sudden, I realized I was being presented with a pretty intense “performance” of discomfort. And the question came to me—What was actually happening? I believe this was a message from God, encouraging me to think more deeply. I realized that as big and important as this “performance” of pain and discord seemed to be, it wasn’t where I was going to find the truth. What was the truth?
I didn’t start firing good ideas at the discord to make the discord go away, because the performance has nothing of value to say. Instead, I admitted the truth that I am good because God is good, and that that goodness couldn’t be taken away from me. Within a minute of that calming sense that God, Truth, was present and powerful, I was completely free. I was able to get up and move forward; and I have felt well ever since then.
I realized in retrospect what was going on. In every healing I’ve experienced, I’ve had a willingness to look away from trying to find truth in the “performance” of the material senses, trying to figure out the truth from what must be a lie, and instead look to God to find out what was really going on.
Where did that notion that you’re sick or that you’re in a situation that’s untenable come from?
I believe that’s the wrong question, because I think it’s the question that is the “ticket” that gets us into the performance, the “magic show,” plops us down in the seat, and then we watch the whole show. Except this isn’t fun; this hurts. The questions come: “Where did this come from? Why is this happening? What do I do?” And the biggest question, I think, is, “Does this mean there’s something wrong?” All those questions seem really important from a diagnostic standpoint because we want to know what’s wrong so we can fix it. But Christian Science invites us to consider, that if this whole premise of sensation in matter is false, then there is nothing to find there, whatever answer you think you’re going to come up with.
What I’ve learned to ask, any time I’m praying for myself or for other people in my professional practice, is “What’s actually happening?” versus trying to figure out what seems to be happening.
So what was actually happening, then, in that situation?
God and His love. God, being Spirit, maintaining me as spiritual. That is what is happening. Jesus’ whole ministry was predicated on the kingdom of heaven being here. He demonstrated it in his healing, he proclaimed it in his parables, he taught it directly to his disciples. God’s action is in effect, and that isn’t balanced with un-heavenliness. There’s not a mix of heaven and hell.
The important thing is that I am not trying to will myself into a healing. I’m not trying to manifest health into my life by declaring the truth. I am admitting that the Truth is in fact true and therefore present. This takes away fascination with the problem. And because I’m no longer fascinated with the performance, I have room for the truth; and because truth is active, it heals me, and it can heal everyone.
That’s why that question of “Where did this come from?” is unhelpful, because it’s inviting us to orient our thought in a direction that won’t yield any actual answers, or illuminate progress. It’s that ticket into the magic show where you’ll see lots of stuff, but you won’t see the truth.
From the audience’s perspective, that would be being distracted, right? The magician is creating these sort of intentional distractions that the audience isn’t expecting.
The audience doesn’t think of it as being distracted; they think they’re watching something real. The magician is convincing you it’s the real thing. If you’re enjoying a magic trick, you’re giving your consent to being distracted. And then you don’t see what’s really happening.
I’ve heard the same thing about hypnotism, too, that you can’t be hypnotized unless you give your consent.
That’s right. When I was in college, I went to a hypnotist’s show. It was a college social event, and the hypnotist started off saying, “Everybody put your hands out and pretend you’re holding a bucket. And now the bucket’s filled with water. Imagine what that’s like.” And then he told us that the bucket was empty. The arms of half the people in the audience flew up because the imaginary water was gone. But I had decided that I wasn’t going to do it. I knew I wasn’t holding a bucket. I was just there with my friends. I didn’t feel any effect from the hypnotism, and I realized then that consent to hypnotism was crucial for hypnotism to work. In magic tricks, you’re willing to get fooled, and so you’re drawn in by the performance.
I think some people would ask if you’re distracting yourself from the distraction. What would you say?
I’m so glad you asked that. It is definitely not a case of just thinking about nice things. We are not trying to distract ourselves with a more clever, happier magic trick.
In the healing example I shared, I mentioned specifically that a thought, a question, came to me. And that’s what I find happens very often—that God is speaking to us—and we need to be willing to stop insisting on the legitimacy of a problem. I think we do that a lot. And that’s why I am so grateful that God is Love. We’re not desperately or angrily yelling at ourselves or others, trying to distract them or convince them to do something else. Rather, we have this beautiful invitation to consider looking in another direction, to consider looking to a different source of information.
The material senses are the source of information about pain, discord, pleasure, or excitement. But the problem with that is, the material senses don’t actually convey real information; matter doesn’t convey sensation.
So it’s not about distracting myself with a different, more pleasant thing. It’s being willing to not look to the lie. And because I know that God is Truth, I’m letting God show me the truth—letting Him heal me instead of me saying I’m going to make it all right myself. I’m letting God show me what’s already happening, show me the presence of heaven.
When you say “show me the presence of heaven,” that’s sort of the soul of a prayer, isn’t it? As I was thinking about how you turn away from the claim that you are sick, your prayer is, “Show me the reality that is already present.” And then your role is that of an observer in this process.
I appreciate you mentioning that. Our role is not as a passive observer, but as an active witness. Jesus told his disciples, “And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch” (Mark 13:37). How are we watching? Are we watching with fear? No, we are watching for the presence of heaven. As active witnesses, we’re not passive people wondering what might happen, hoping something good comes along. We are actively casting our mental weight, our attention, on the fact that God is here no matter what else we’re being told, and that’s the primary fact.
You’re changing your perspective to one that is completely spiritual. And as a result, healing happens.
That’s right. I think often of healing as revealing. Healing changes our sense of what’s going on because we’re no longer fascinated with the trick. What Christian Science healing is all about is being open to and leaning more into the fact that we are what God has created. And we can’t be changed or hurt or be made to deviate in any way from His nature, as Spirit, as Love, as goodness.
Something you said struck a chord with me—about no longer being fascinated with the trick. We know that magic isn’t real, so people often think, “Nobody will ever be fooled.” And yet we find ourselves fooled in magic shows all the time. This speaks to the banality of the trick itself. There isn’t power in it. You recognize when you’re learning the trick that there’s nothing really mysterious or magical going on. It’s as banal as any lie.
That’s right. What they do on one video series is they show you the trick, and I’m sitting there saying, “No way!” And then they show you how to do it. Then I think, “That’s so simple. Nobody’s ever going to fool anyone with this,” forgetting that just thirty seconds before, I was completely fooled.
Once you see what’s really going on, you’re no longer fooled or presented with the opposite claim. When I see this magic trick now, I don’t say, “Maybe it’s magic.” I think, “I know what’s actually happening.” But, in a performance, you’ve got to spin a story and you’ve got to tell the audience what you want them to see.
One of the things in this video series is sleight of hand and coin magic—making the coin disappear. The instructor gave this interesting demonstration. He showed a picture of what the human eye actually sees. It’s barely anything. He said that it’s the mind that fills in all the details. Now, I don’t mean to get too much into physiology, but his whole point was that coin magic works because you’re telling the audience, “Look, I’m doing this thing.” But you’re not doing it. They physically do not see what’s actually happening because they’ve bought into the performance.
This is what I was talking about the material senses being liars, because what you are seeing and experiencing is not the truth. It’s your thought which is telling you what’s going on. And I want to say this again: Christian Science is not about convincing yourself with a different thought. It’s being open to God’s thought. It’s His power which heals us. My role is just to take my attention away from the performance, look to the truth, and let the truth heal me.
You said something that I think people might disagree with. You said matter doesn’t convey sensation, and yet a lot of people will say, “I touch a hot stove, I’m going to get burned!” How do you respond to that?
I always do my best to present it simply as an invitation to consider things from a different perspective. I never want to get in a big argument about it. But anyone who’s ever been in a virtual reality simulator, or anyone who’s been in a dream, will tell you that physical sensation, as intense and real as it seems, isn’t reality. Just because you sense something with the material senses doesn’t mean that it’s actually happening—we just think it is.
Christian Science is extending that basic truth. The nerves are demonstrably false some of the time. Do you trust a friend who lies to you some of the time? Well, the answer is you don’t.
Why do we feel the need to be so insistent that the senses are telling us the truth? Why are we insisting that the performance is true? So many people believe that it must be true because we’re seeing it. But just because we see something does not mean that’s actually what’s there.
One time, I was practicing a coin magic trick over and over for about 15 minutes, and my son was watching me more or less the whole time. And I tell you, it’s hard to do magic with my son because he catches me. He doesn’t want to be fooled. He wants to mess me up. Finally, he comes over and says, “Dad, I know that you’re not making the coin disappear, but I don’t know what you’re doing because it is disappearing. So what are you doing?”
It was so funny because he was demanding not to be fooled and yet, because he didn’t know how it was actually happening, all he was seeing was what I was pretending. It was so illuminating to me.
Just sort of falling for it hook, line, and sinker in a sense. And yet he had this intuition.
That’s right. What Christian Science and Christianity present us with is a standard by which we can assess what’s true. One of the beautiful things about Jesus is that he called us to follow him. He called us to engage with his gospel promise that heaven is here. We must rise up! This is an invitation. We can think of Jesus’ healings, his commands to people, as invitations—like when he said to the man who had a withered hand, “Stretch forth thy hand” (Luke 6:10). It’s an invitation to consider things from a different perspective. That’s not willpower. It’s refusing to keep insisting that what the material senses tell you is accurate.
You’ve given us all an invitation not to be tricked. John, that’s a wonderful gift.
It’s been so neat to explore these ideas. We’ve been invited to see the presence of heaven, to see joy, and Jesus even unlocks it for us in what he said and taught. The Gospels say the kingdom of heaven is here, repent (see Matthew 4:17, for example). Repent means to turn. I used to think it just meant, “Watch out, shape up.” But it means “Change your thinking.”
So Jesus is saying, “If you can’t see the kingdom of heaven, look in a different direction, because it is here.” That’s the hope and the love I was talking about, because I know there are people who are struggling so much with pain, fear, concern. It’s not about coldly saying, “That’s not real. You just need to shape up.” It’s the invitation of compassionate love that says, “You are loved; and in that truth, that space of being loved, look in a different direction.”
I’m not saying it’s someone’s fault that they’re having a hard time, but we shouldn’t cast our weight on the side of the lie if we are to defeat the lie. Instead of insisting on the lie, we can be open to what is true. God loves what He made and it is very good. And we are what God has made.
